00:00

But we had to clear out a real dumpster for him to stand inside this thing that I was doing that I guess who is going to be the guy who was ready to throw him in the downstairs into there I am standing in this dumpster. And for me that my why was so strong I I so desperately wanted to be there. Like the reason for me being on that set was still so incredibly real for me and tangible for me that I did it with a smile on my face.

00:30

Hey, it’s Nate Disarro and welcome to titans of industry, the podcast where I talk to industry leaders and innovators who are at the top of their game and leading the pack in their fields uncovering some of the best stories in today’s business landscape. In today’s episode, I sit down with Dwayne Logan, freelance filmmaker and director based in Nashville who has a passion for sharing the human experience through film. Dwayne a Chicago native talks about how his journey to becoming a film director had an unconventional path as he intended to get to Los Angeles, but had a detour through Nashville and never left. he recounts the events and experiences that drove him to create his first short film, black thoughts and how he values each and every person that plays a part in his creative endeavors. we dive into the realities of film production and talk about the importance of hard work and having the right connections to grow your career. Now, on a personal note, Dwayne is one of the most humble people I’ve ever met. So don’t let his humility take away from his creative genius and desire to make the world a better place.

01:32

Now, let’s get to the episode.

01:36

But before we do, our team at content Titan wants you to know that we understand the challenges business leaders and marketers are facing right now, with moving to a more virtual world. We are experts in taking human connections and turning them digital. From virtual Events and Video presentations to promotional content and advertising. We’re here to help guide you through the process of staying in front of your audience and making your life a little bit easier. People tell us all the time that they are lost and don’t know what to say or do and we exist to help your business continue to move forward, virtually. So if you’re ready to take your business and content strategy, virtual, we’re ready to help. Let’s get your business back to business.

02:20

Now, here’s my conversation with Dwayne Logan.

02:25

Dwayne, thanks for jumping on the podcast with us really appreciate it. Looking forward to this time.

02:30

I have heard some amazing things about you. We’ve had a little bit of a pre conversation. So excited to jump in and go a little deeper here. But I want to start just a little quick overview. Tell me how you ended up sitting in the chair you’re in right now in Mount Juliet, Tennessee. Oh, man, Nate, thanks so much for having me excited to be here. Certainly an honor.

02:53

I’m a freelance filmmaker, Director slash ad.

02:58

And it’s been it’s been one heck of a heck of a ride getting to this point. And

03:05

the short end of it is, man, I had some very, very strong reasons that made me think that I could use the art of filmmaking to make a difference. And to grant after that full, full speed.

03:18

A little bit. We’ll talk to me about kind of how you got into filmmaking. How did you decide that this was a artistic expression that you wanted to use? What was what was your kind of impetus for becoming a an artist in this way?

03:32

Man, yeah, if you ask my mother and she’ll tell you that it was all genetics that are came from her like I’m an artist, your grandmother who was an artist, and now you’re destined to be the artist.

03:44

The man is one of the one of the six kids who grew up interstate Chicago and

03:51

out of the six, I think I kind of became the the shoulder to cry on a bit sometimes within the house. And then it turned into a similar thing outside of the house with friends. And as I got older,

04:07

and going into school, I became just kind of the listening year, eventually,

04:13

jump jumped over into I was snatched up by this really incredible teacher in high school that that saw me and said, You need to be on the gymnastics team. And she forced me into into that sport. And that support gave birth to me becoming a coach for USA Gymnastics and all of that, that listening very quickly became mentoring with a lot of athletes and

04:38

may just started to realize that

04:42

in these conversations, we’re having so much progress with some of these kids that were really in distressed situations at home. And you wonder how can I do this on a bigger scale? Like how could we have these meaningful conversations with more people at once and

05:00

You realize that kids aren’t listening to parents it’s so much is as they are their favorite musician. They’re not listening to teachers as much as they, they follow their favorite actor or actress and this was prior to Instagram and Snapchat and tik tok and Twitter.

05:19

Certainly more so the case now, but I looked at that and kind of had this really, really strong feeling that, okay, that’s

05:28

if really at the heart of coaching. For me, it’s about seeing these kids succeed. And maybe the goal in life is to just see these kids and see people succeed, and to make a difference with that. And so my wife and I sold everything we owned, thought we were headed to LA and somehow landed the National

05:49

Gallery there, but it was certainly not an expected detour. Yeah, that’s quite the detour from Chicago, especially it’s kind of the wrong way.

05:59

So give me a quick version. How did you end up in Nashville? When you when you were planning on going to LA,

06:07

my wife and I were looking

06:10

at trying to find a roommate in the LA area. And because the cost of living was just so high, it just seemed to make sense to go that route. And we just could not find anyone that was willing to take a married couple for some strange reason. It was like, oh, if it’s just a dude, you can hang with us, dude, you’re just the ladies you can hang with this ladies. But you married couples, no thanks to my brother just had a baby. And we said, well, let’s go to Nashville and visit

06:40

love on that little one and figure out what in the world we’re going to do. Because at the time, we had all of our belongings packed into our vehicle, and we sold most of what we had kept the bare minimum.

06:55

And once we got here, my sister just continued to please like check Nashville, you can do this home thing and Nashville. Being from Chicago, I thought Nashville, it was just

07:07

pasture was with horses and cars. It’s like what I found Nashville. I don’t know that that exists. And I’m sure now if we,

07:17

you know, we just were eliminating options. In some cases, options were being eliminated for us. And so decided to take a look and threw on a suit and tie and printed out a few resumes and went and beat the streets. And was repeatedly told, no thanks. We don’t have anything here for you. Sorry, dry somewhere else. And found out that there was

07:44

a recording studio in town that had this world class setup.

07:50

And decided, hey, maybe I could maybe there’s something for me there. I went there and spoke to the person that answered the door and said, Oh, come back next week. And came back next week. And he’s like, we need to go on right away here. It’s like soul, this is it. This is gonna be it and talk to my wife’s like, I think this is this is what we were looking for. This is an opportunity to get hands on experience. And I’m one of the probably many people that believed Quentin Tarantino when he said, Forget film school, just get out there and get some hands on experience. So like, we’re going to do that.

08:26

We took cheese, probably 80% of our savings and had to dump them into an apartment, because we didn’t have jobs to prove income. So they went on to

08:38

almost a year’s worth of rent upfront, made that investment

08:43

and came back next week. And it was Oh, did you go next week, and just hang out today. We’ll get you next week. And the next week was the same story. And the next week was the same story. The next week was the same story and it never panned out. I never touched the camera never touched a piece of equipment.

09:01

And we looked up and we’re like well, we don’t have any money. And we better figure this out. And the short version of that we decided to try to take the one vehicle turn it into two we’re on a carmax parking lot and she’s on one end of the lot I was on the other and I have

09:21

a history of becoming a nerd by necessity.

09:25

This is one of those

09:27

Yeah, it’s like when you need it you got to learn it. And

09:32

the I just studying the market car market she’s like oh to 2006 Pontiac g six with 13,000 miles is like a

09:42

14 to she’s like you’re off by 200 bucks.

09:47

Like exporting boards and guys like you want a job segment and of course the car salesman and it’s like no, you’d be a buyer. you’d help us determine the value of the cars on the lot and you work in a buyers department. I got some

10:00

into that, and she went back to working she was at the time trying very hard to

10:06

rise through the ranks in Walgreens into the pharmaceutical department.

10:14

And she started out in the photo lab and cashier and before you know that at the time, you didn’t have to go to school, to get the certificate to be a pharmacy technician, you could do it, you could you Walgreens would pay for the training. So she jumped back into that, and it was working really hard. And I figured I’d make my contribution by joining the ranks at karma x at the

10:39

passport man about three months of opening up cars and Tennessee summers to try the option out what was inside them, you get hit in the face with that key over and over and over again, you’re trying to take pictures like this is crazy, we did not sell everything that we own to be sweating with cicadas and

11:01

crazy, crazy cars on carmax slide. And so I got really serious again, it’s like it’s there, I’m going to find it and found out about the 48 hour Film Festival

11:13

went to the meet and greet for for that.

11:18

And at the time I put myself through an online version of phone schools, every bit of information that I could find that was just consuming it stacks of note cards all over the place and, and print out some books that were made free on mine, I was just consuming information as fast as I could I

11:36

thought that would have been an opportunity to apply some of it’s like if I could just see these cameras that I’ve been reading about. And if I can just touch one of these boom poles, it just gave me a shot.

11:48

And the organizers wife came in she’s got boxes in her hand. So he’s dropping things left and right. And I asked them, hey, do you need a hand? And she’s like, No, no, no, no, we’re fine. We’re fine. We’re fine. She goes back out to the car, she comes back in and I grab a box and she’s like, then three more in the trunk. And Come on, come on back.

12:08

In she’s like, you know what I like you, I’m going to introduce you to my husband. Her husband was a gaffer in town, Jeff Gordon, who was just so incredibly gracious,

12:22

and allowed a conversation and I just, I probably hit him with

12:28

that sort of a feeling that a dad gets when he comes home after his kids had a really exciting days like and you know, and then and there was this and then this, what about this? What about that? What about is a you know, you should meet Greg page, the owner of the studio. And so he introduced me to Greg page, Greg page. So you know, I don’t have any things that I can offer you opportunity wise, but you should know Jen at it. And so he bounced me over to Janet IV via email. And she needed some props built. She was taking Janet’s planet, her TV show on the road as a live production. It’s like I need some props built and really very great things and love this email that you sent me.

13:13

Can you can you help out with that. So it meant my father in law just gave me a toolbox. I’m not sure what’s in it, but I’ll be winging it and we’ll figure it out. And

13:23

I can’t even count how many hours of volunteering to build props and get get her set up and running.

13:32

And one day she said, You know you’ve done such a good job, you should show up to the live taping of some of the content that we’re going to have on one of the screens. And it was just like this is it, I finally get to see all the films that are loved by and on the day the all of the the crew members are setting up and things are going smoothly. And all of a sudden, they were like, oh boy, we week, we’ve our prompter.

13:56

Guy, the person who’s going to run the prompter is in here.

14:00

And what are we going to do? And I raised the hand said, Hey, I can give it a shot. And it’s like, No, you don’t understand like, this is a thing you can do. It’s like, well, I if if it comes to it, I’ll

14:13

happily jump in and figure it out. And

14:17

I forget who this young lady was she was like, let’s just put him in front of this laptop. And yeah, we’ve got to go, we got to shoot. And we start filming. And before you know that one of the lead actors stopped and he’s like, I just want to say is one of the smoothest teleprompter experience with other heads like yes.

14:39

Yes, yes. And so we continue on then a bit later in the day. There’s a moment where one of the guys wanted to tell a joke in sign language or something like that. And it just so happened to be within a very limited range of sign language that I knew and

14:55

helped him out with that. He’s like, make sure this guy’s on the next one. We like him.

15:00

Up until the end of the day two ACS came over and they said, Hey, I like what I saw today, I’m going to bounce your name over to this person and bounce yours to this one. And one of the names was Karen Martin, at the time when she was a producer in town, and the word was, you’ll get one shot. And if you do, well, you’re gonna, you’re gonna be alright, if you don’t do well, I hate to tell you, but you’re probably not working this town again. Oh, boy. And sure enough, about a week later, I got the call. And it was from Karen Martin. And it was to come out to a set and I asked Jeff, I said, What can I do? How can I be ready. And he gave me some good tips. And one of them was to learn the names of all of the people

15:46

above the line and what they do and what they’ve done. And then also understand what the DP what his record looks like. And so did that. And stayed up all night doing that.

15:59

And was late for my first shoot on set. Oh, man.

16:05

It was the worst case scenario. Yeah, it’s like the number one rule is don’t be late, you know, start times work time. There. I was late. And I got there on the day. And I was given a very hard time by some of the folks that were on that set. And I was like, hey, like, why don’t we have the guy that showed up late do that lock up and

16:25

wait to do this?

16:28

Man, I thought it was over as soon as it began.

16:33

But fast forward, there’s this opportunity to

16:38

they wanted to

16:40

part of the show the narrative was to figure out and crack these recipes, like these really famous recipes in the world. And this one was for Cinnabon. And so they The idea was the show host would be dumpster diving to try to find these secrets. But we had to clear out a real dumpster. For him to stand inside this thing. They’re like what what was doing that, I guess who is going to be the guy who was ready to throw him in the downstair into there I am standing in this dumpster. And for me that my why was so strong, right? I I so desperately wanted to be there. Like the reason for me being on that set was still so incredibly

17:21

real for me and tangible for me that I did it with a smile on my face. And Jeff snapped a photo of me standing in this dumpster and said Hooray for Hollywood

17:33

on the bottom of it, and pay for it just did. One of the gaffers came over to me. And she was so gracious and money and say, Hey, I love what I saw today. I’ve listened to everything I’ve said today, and I’ve listened to you. And some people try to kind of give you a bit of a tough time. And I’ve never met you. But I guarantee you, I’m going to see a lot more of you because I’m going to tell everybody that I know that you need to be on set. And it’s been that kind of experience in this town. Since the day that I got here. Honestly, there have been certainly a group of people that have tried very hard to make it difficult for me, but most memorable has been the group of people that went out of their way to make sure that that man, I just think I got every single opportunity that they could give me

18:23

and I blinked

18:25

and I was probably pa on set

18:30

on nothing but music videos and commercials and the long form content as pa I said probably about six days a week for about two and a half years straight.

18:42

It’s incredible. I mean, that kind of workload is really shows a testament to just who you are and kind of the amount of work you’re doing.

18:50

Nobody gets to do that on a freelance basis. It’s it really is like,

18:56

at least for me, it’s it felt miraculous to do that. I mean, normally if you’re, if you’re on maybe a feature film or something like that, you might want those kinds of days. But right short form, the short form it was, it was crazy. And the experience that I gained from that, especially with each project being so sure, to many different directors, so many different producers, so many different DVDs.

19:24

The ability to really look around and and and learn was incredible, especially since so many of those projects were happening with crews that were brought in from out of town so you got to experience in New York without having to be in New York, you got to experience la production without being in LA and it was is is a fun fun ride. That’s really cool man. I love that story. I think you know, there’s a lot that we could go into to dissect some of that especially for you know, young people up and coming in the industry. Really any industry that so

20:00

Has that that freelance base that that mentality of kind of, you’re only as good as your last job?

20:07

Which I remember when I first heard that in this industry, and I was like, wait, wait, what does that mean? You know, and then you realize, Oh, I better be good on this job, or else I won’t get the next one. And but you know, I’ve had the same experience in Nashville, anybody that I hire that does a good job. It’s amazing to see how quickly you know, people are looking for recommendations, people need somebody to, to work on their next shoot, and I’m like, oh, hire this guy, you know, he was great, or hire this girl, she did nothing but amazing things, things that I didn’t even ask her to do. And, you know, when you’re directing and producing a shoot, you’ve got to have those people at your at your side. You know, a lot of people I think that that may be listened to podcast and don’t know a ton about the film industry of production world. I mean, it is all about the people you surround yourself with on whether or not that is going to be a

21:00

good production, and you’re going to get the things that you need at the end of it. You know, to your point, smooth teleprompter is a big deal. You know, to jump in there day one and knock that thing out. That’s, that’s pretty fun. So, alright, fast forward, you get into the ad roll, which, for anybody that doesn’t know what an ad is assistant director, basically, for simplification terms, it’s the it’s the director of operations on a shoot, you’re the person that kind of directs traffic, make sure the next thing is ready to go. You’re getting people where they need to be. So how did you fall into that role? And what did that look like? Kind of early on and in the ad days? Oh, man, the The first time I really started to comprehend what an ad

21:46

what his role was, we were on the shoot. And then we had cars and they were those pyrotechnics. And they were all these moving parts. And I said to myself very clearly I never ever want to be that guy.

22:00

is hilarious. Because

22:02

shoot after shoot,

22:05

I had a DS that eventually got to a point where they said, I won’t take a job unless this guy’s with me. And

22:15

I’m still flabbergasted by that, that any professional in any business would say, hey, if you want me You have to bring in this guy as well. So that’s crazy, especially for someone to be an entry level employee to say, hey, I need this PA, like if I’m on set, and this pa has to be there with me. So you got essentially a guy that’s at the top end of the food chain saying I need someone that’s at the bottom of the food chain, if you want me to be there. And so that was really remarkable. And eventually that turned into

22:50

this,

22:52

this wonderful thing that would happen if the shoots grew beyond their intended scope, where the ABS would say, hey, you need somebody to go and run that second unit, send Dwayne Dwayne over there and do this like Oh, man, are you sure as I get over there? Yeah, you you know exactly what this this is supposed to look like because the ever call

23:13

pa is giving me a hard time when the leads will come across the walkie when they needed to update and it went from hay production or Hey, pa is that hey, Dwayne, hey, Dwayne, Dwayne, Dwayne, come on.

23:29

Man, I’m just, I’m just trying to put my head down and work hard. That’s That’s all I care about. I

23:35

remember being teased about having just this massive.

23:41

It’s like a tool belt turned into a fanny pack with his big binder and folder on it, all these things hanging off of it, because I just thought I should be ready for just about anything. And it was,

23:53

yeah, after lunch when the directors like, like, my breath smells terrible from those onions, there’s gum and this fanny pack, and it’s like, bragging, like, Alright, kid.

24:04

And when they say, hey, you’re going to go on a run, and this is we need this ASAP. And it’s gotta be just so there’s a notepad in there just to make sure that it’s written down to the tee.

24:16

And those the 80s forced me into Av. And I think I’m really grateful that it happened that way, because it happened with such an enormous amount of respect for the role.

24:28

And I certainly didn’t take any of it for granted.

24:32

But man, I blinked and it went from working as the volunteer volunteer ad on some of the second units to being the second second ad without the title without the pay. And then I get the title but not the pay and then you got to pay me title but by that time, I’d already been working as second ad without the title without the pay. And then before you know it, man, I turned around and I said, Oh my gosh, like this ad is asking me to do union shoots.

25:00

I’ve got to turn in this book to the unions in order to be able to do these union shoots, I’ve got enough days to do it. And so you turn in that book.

25:08

And then I’m working as a union second ad. But then I’m also starting to first ad things. By recommendation of other atheists. They’re like, I can’t take this job. In Blaine Logan, a call.

25:23

And so it really was, is this wonderful thing that happened were very,

25:29

without reaching for this position or that title. And in trying to kind of battle my way to it.

25:39

There’s, there’s kind of a passing of a torch. And that happened. And I’m still so grateful that it happened that way, especially in a small town in a small community where, where they certainly could have been a lot of ruffled feathers.

25:52

I love that. Well, so man, again, I can talk about forever, because I just didn’t know what you’re saying makes me think of all the people on set that I’ve had that I’m just like, you’re ready, go run that unit, or go do this or go do that. And I think the the mentality that goes into what it takes to make that climb, and so quickly, and be trusted by so many people, and this goes really for any industry, right? I mean, in our world, it’s it’s the world of film and production. But

26:24

in any industry, if you’ve got somebody that you can trust, regardless of their skill and experience level, you just know, they’re going to figure out how to get the job done.

26:32

And they’re gonna hustle, and they’re not going to sit back. And you know, they may have imperfections, they may show up late on the first day, but they quickly make up for it, you know, and,

26:44

but, but all that experience that you gain so quickly, and just from being a part of so many projects ultimately led you to kind of where you’re at now, what you’re doing now. And essentially, you’re a director. But you’re so much more than that. You’re doing so many cool things. I want to save us time to get into some of that. But why don’t you talk to me about this, this short film that that you concepted created put out in the world and where it’s what it’s doing. Yeah, man you saw, right, because there’s just so many things there, like in the ad or other would be so fascinating to kind of dive into

27:24

the death of Mr. Berry, hit me like a ton of bricks.

27:33

I just

27:35

I felt as though, I mean, I don’t sleep as it is, but I just I was restless, and, and really, really felt like I had to say something, I had to do something I had to use whatever skills or talent that I had to try to make a difference and went back to the guys that evolved into Hey,

27:56

I’ve got to make this feat. I just have to I don’t know how but I’ve got to make this piece and and they came back and said Dwayne, we were with you. Maybe we can scale down we could remove a scene here a scene there.

28:10

As they go, man, I don’t I don’t know what that looks like how God how can I remove a scene here a scene there because each scene is so pertinent to what’s being seen in the world right now. And, and they spoke and came back and said, Hey, man, listen, let’s let’s do this. Let’s, if you want to, if you want to, if this is what really, really, really just one of those things where you’re just you’re gonna explode, let’s do it, let’s figure out a way to do it. And by that time, I had a moment of clarity where it’s just like playing, it’s a pandemic, like, these guys probably don’t even know if they’re going to be to keep their doors open.

28:49

Have a conversation that’s a little bit more mindful. So I returned with an apology. It’s like, I’m so sorry, I was short sighted. I was in this mode where I just wanted to put a bandaid on the world or heal it or hold it or hug it or something to help.

29:06

And I overlooked the logistics of what it means to bring a film to life. And I said No, man, don’t worry. But out of that conversation, and came this this request to Hey, if if I can have a week, and if you guys are now in this position where it’s like, hey, let’s do something. Can I have a week to just go into a closet and think about maybe another way to talk about what’s happening? And said do you take all the time you need and came back with

29:36

the script, which would have at the time only been about a five or 10 minute read for what is now a black thoughts, a 30 minute short film. And they both were excited about it. And there’s another fantastic human over there. Daniel, who was also really excited about it, and it was a part of these conversations and they were like, let’s do it. And a couple of days will go by and I say hey

30:00

guys sorry, is a little bit longer, that’s fine as I go back and delete a bit longer because I feel like we’re going there, we got to go there.

30:11

And it grew and it grew and it grew. And,

30:15

man, now it’s, it is out in into the world, and it’s making its round, it’s making an impact, and it’s starting conversations and is doing so much more than I could have ever imagined that it would have done. And

30:28

I had an opportunity to direct a couple of commercials with these guys prior to black dots. But this is my first short film,

30:38

ever into existence. And, and so happy that that is the project that that I was able to start with, because I feel like it sets the groundwork for anything that I’d like to say, as a director from here for man, I

30:53

in a different way. You know, I think in a lot of ways, we all by human nature, we’re all the same, but we’re all different, right? Like we all have the same feelings, the same urges the same things that sort of control different pieces of what we can and can’t do. And one of the things we can’t do is when we’re so compelled by something, we can’t sit still we can’t sleep, we can’t let that thing just died. Because it’s it’s too big. And we realize there’s there’s some element of life that’s bigger than us. And we have to take action towards it.

31:27

I felt that in my own way. It’s it’s completely different than the way you felt that but I know everybody that and at some point in life, you realize, this is my thing, this is the thing that if if this is my Hill to die on this, this is it. I’m here. And

31:45

it sounds like this was that moment for you, like you, you couldn’t let this go by you couldn’t sit back and say, Well, you know what, we’ll get to this eventually, we’ll, I’ll go to sleep tonight, I’ll wake up tomorrow. And it’s gonna be a new day. And I can focus on other things, but but it kept consuming you is what it sounds like. And absolutely, and it’s so perfectly articulated there it was 100%, the hill that I would just is like,

32:12

if I don’t accomplish anything else in this world, I’ve got to climb this hill and get this thing down.

32:19

And it was, especially because the peace was in so many ways.

32:26

A piece that would address

32:29

my life as a whole.

32:31

In the past and in what also speak to my life in the future. It really, it’s a piece that spans what’s taken

32:43

more than three decades almost for now, figuring out how old I am, it took all these years to make me the man that I am and to

32:56

really make me very passionate about some of the things that I’m very passionate about.

33:02

And had we had we made this piece a year prior I think I would have still, I felt very, very passionate about getting it into the world. But man, in the middle of 2020 it was

33:20

totally one of those things where it’s like if I don’t do this now, but if today does does not become the day, I just I don’t know how I will continue to exist as a human it must come out of my mind and out of my heart and into existence and was so incredibly grateful and fortunate to to have these guys and sure enough, they were in a position where they were wondering, are we going to be able to keep the doors open, I had no idea. And for them to I think it turned into one of those moments of combining of apart and I love Joel’s way of saying he said Dwayne, you know, what we need to do on this one is we just we just need to be gasoline and like because you’re just like this burn and fire we’re just gonna keep throwing gas on it however we can and if that’s like, you know, we’ve got cameras we can throw, then we’ll throw the cameras out and we can recruit it it with throw the creative, but we just need to get continue to pour gas on this fire man because you’re just you just, you’re there and we need to defeat and so really, really fortunate. So, you you mentioned earlier, you know the elements of social justice that we’re important and we’ve teased this idea of this short film black dots give give me the the synopsis what are we talking about here? And of course, we want to encourage people to be able to take a look at it. But But why was their motivation to write this and get this out to the world and essentially what is what are we talking about?

34:51

The so by thoughts is a short film that

34:56

as I looked around the the United States

35:00

What was happening and listening to conversations that people were having?

35:05

concerning like the topics of racism and

35:11

social justice and police reform and Jay Z get into so many of these other buzz terms like

35:20

white privilege and things like that. And it’s like mandates so many of these conversations are

35:27

non productive, they’re unproductive because people get hung up on terms or because the context isn’t there to really have some of these conversations that are very important.

35:38

On one hand, you see the killing of a of an unarmed man in the street. And something that should be very easy to converse about on a just a human level becomes incredibly complicated because politics jump in and, and personal histories jumping in a war grandpa taught me this. And so this is what I believe, and this is how I feel, or my brother is an officer. And this is how I feel, or I’m just a black man, and I want to support another black man. And this is how I feel. And it was like, there’s so much dissension, and there’s so much

36:13

separate separation, and there’s, there’s so many roadblocks to productive conversation that could actually bring us together and help solve some of these problems.

36:26

And seeing that, from my perspective,

36:30

that I been given a, I think, is a unique opportunity to to hear a lot of different sides of those conversations. My wife is from Wapakoneta, Ohio,

36:42

and a very small town, very conservative town, very red town, my family being from Chicago.

36:54

Also conservative people, but more blue leaning in a lot of ways, because that’s what you’re supposed to do, because you’re got brown skin, so you vote blue.

37:06

And then being a coach in the world of gymnastics, also then seeing a different side of conversation, because now it’s not so much about red or blue. It’s about wealthy versus poor. You hear some of the conversations that just very wealthy people are having, then you jump into the film business and you hear

37:29

conversations being had with not just wealthy people, but very liberal, wealthy people. And it’s like, all these worlds coming together. And they’re all saying in so many ways, some of the same things, but

37:41

throw these hangups and hiccups. And so I made this film as a way to, hopefully a

37:49

I’m such a firm believer that the past is prologue that we cannot comprehend the present or the future without an understanding of how we got here.

38:00

Until wanted to make something that touched on that, how did we get here today? And why are we seeing what we’re seeing, but also wanted to make something that

38:14

was was going to come from this standpoint, not of not from a political side, not from a religious side, but from a human decide of humanity. And so really wanted to just humanize

38:32

some of these, these really difficult things, and I couldn’t find a better way to do it than to just make myself really vulnerable. And so it’s the title blackfox. These are the inner thoughts that I would encounter from a day to day basis. And as I look out my front window, and as I go to work, and I hear what’s being said, and I have conversations, these are the ways that I interpret those things. And ideally,

39:03

the goal was to, to start conversations about some of these things that could potentially then come from a place of saying, Hey,

39:13

I heard the heart of the man on this, versus immediately arriving at the table with any preconceived notions, I heard the heart of a man of a hippo, the human soul. I saw that perspective. And now we can converse regarding that perspective.

39:31

Too lofty goal, it’s making the assumption that

39:36

people can change and having hope in humanity.

39:40

It’s making the the really, really, really intensely

39:47

hopeful leap into thinking that

39:52

things that evils that have been around in this country for hundreds and hundreds of years can can be undone, but it’s

40:00

making a dent.

40:01

That’s really cool, man. I mean,

40:04

you’re right, there’s so much that, that we want to accomplish through the work we put out and change and creating hope those are, those are big, huge, lofty goals. And I think one of the hardest things to comprehend with that is, is that

40:23

we can create something and ultimately, it can be an agent for change. But people on the other end have to be recipient in a way that they’re willing to change. You know, because, I mean, you give somebody a paintbrush and say, change this canvas, they have to be willing to do it, they have to be willing to dip the paint

40:44

on the brush, and paint a new picture. And you’ve you’ve given them the tools to change to think through to move to I mean, it’s such a beautifully shot. piece.

40:58

It’s very clean. I love that about it. But it does give give me the viewer this this insight that I’m inside your head, you know that that kind of I’m there, just the way you visually created it

41:13

was that the goal going into it was to kind of give it this mentality of I want the viewer to be inside my head, I want these these black thoughts to be this is what the viewer seeing it’s, it’s, it’s the inside of me? or What was your kind of mindset going into setting this thing up visually? And then conversely, how did you pull this thing together? I mean, you kind of set us up on how it came together. But did you know who you were going to bring in to help you pull this thing off? Did you know you were going to be such an integral part of this somebody who doesn’t want to be necessarily known or put out there in the world? Man? Yeah, that was a, I think the part of how

41:54

logistically it was going to fall together. I think there’s a lot of the experiences and ad that that kind of kicked into gear once we realized that it would be difficult to shoot during COVID. And that experience, I think, very naturally became a part of the writing process of saying, hey, how could we do this in an impactful way, but in a logistically feasible way.

42:18

And there’s certainly a part of it that was just strictly about practicality to remove very dollars and cents standpoint, how can we achieve the desired goal

42:31

with the resources that we have.

42:34

But then also the idea.

42:38

I’m really happy that the core idea was really, really clear, which is, we’ve got to essentially, and you hate to even mention it but at the root of a lot of what drives racism is this idea that some people are less human than others.

43:01

And then you could really start to dive into

43:05

the impact of eugenics on the way that we think in this country and the all these four sciences that were brought about to say that okay, well black people don’t feel pain in the same way and they have lower IQ than they really are just property it’s you’ve got a cow over there, you got a horse over there, you have a cow and that cow, you have a black man to pick this you have a black woman to nurse your kids that there’s this idea that we were just things to think the one of the initial aims was to say, Can we can i re humanize? The black man, the black woman, the black child, in this conversation, and from the standpoint of re humanizing Zin offer some context about how we got here.

43:55

It just screamed that the best way to do that would be to say, hey, well, here is the heart of of a man and I’ll allow it to be mine. And,

44:05

man, some conversations with my wife were like,

44:09

you know, like, once you do that, there’s no there’s no, you can’t go back from that. Like once you put yourself out there that you there’s there’s no turning around and saying, Oh, well, I like to close this door. Now you guys jumped into my life and into my heart into things that I care very much about. But no thanks. You can leave now. Like once it’s open it open. But we felt like that was a The best way to do that. Is to say like, okay, here, here it is. I mean,

44:38

the concept is very much at home, not only from that the logistics and practicality standpoint and saying, Hey, we can do this on a budget, but it was at home creatively because it’s like, let’s strip away all the things that that potentially distract from that that would distract you from being able to say, Hey, this is what I’m focused on.

45:00

Focus on the human heart on the words and on the content. I love it well, and the cool thing about it to me, and I don’t know what conversations you’ve had around it, since its released, and I know you’ve mentioned it’s making a film festival circuit.

45:14

But it’s it’s, it almost goes beyond film, right this is this is almost something that could be a live performance. This is something that can be done in different forms of of theatrical ways. I think you’ve done a fantastic job of making people literally just see the inside of a human’s head and say, hang on, forget everything I’ve known before. Because there’s truth in this, there’s reality in this and you can’t deny it. Well, one things we talk about a lot on this podcast is this idea of doing business better. And you know, I think the pandemics taught us a lot about how we have to do business, how we have to conduct business in a lot of ways. But when you think about all your experiences, and all the sets, you’ve been on all the projects, you’ve worked with all the people you’ve worked with, what stands out to you about ways that that you’re trying to do business better, or that the industry as a whole is trying to do business better?

46:12

And the other great question the the film industry as a whole, I don’t think has a great reputation for putting people first

46:23

as it is, especially at least in my experience.

46:28

In my experience, the film industry is about get the shot, get the project and get it at all costs.

46:35

And I think that’s how we end up with stories. Like, you know, the what happened to Sarah Jones, and you know, the poor young lady that lost their Lifeline on a film set, because they just had to get the shot on a set of railroad tracks.

46:51

And one of the things that I’m really, really passionate about is making sure that when crew members show up on onset that a bit know that they’re very valued that, hey, you being here makes a difference to makes an impact, you have worth you have value.

47:09

And also being able to to make sure that they know that they’re going to that there’s someone that is an advocate for them.

47:19

From a safety standpoint, from a pay standpoint, okay, when you show up here, we’re not trying to get as much of you for as little as possible, we want to make sure that hey, you know that you have worth and that that’s not just in words, but it can be Indeed,

47:38

we can pay you what you should be paid. I mean, all of those things really, really important to me. And that’s why it’s difficult for me to just jump in at the first opportunity when someone says, hey, yeah, let’s work together. So how do you treat people? And what is your reputation for treating people? And how does that then reflect on me? Because that’s at the forefront of what I care about. And if there’s a compromise there, and maybe this doesn’t work out so great.

48:07

And I wish that that was a more widespread feeling, because, man, I just I had the hardest time especially

48:17

right in the middle of

48:21

transitioning from a non union to Union ad and being able to work both have having to negotiate with rate. And before you know, it’s like okay, well producer calls, and they’re like, hey, what can you do this shoot, you know, it’s, we work together a lot, and we don’t have the money. And so you drop the rate for that. And then they call again, and the rate drops a bit more. Now the rate that you dropped two becomes the new rate. And the rate that you drop to after that becomes the new rate. And it’s just like, every time you pick up the phone, you feel like you’re being nickeled and dimed to death. And you feel like the you have to fight to convey to the people that that are calling you, I have value, I can bring value to the set, you called me for a reason. Let’s have that value reflected and always possible. And so really, really desperately want to make sure that that’s something that I’m known for in this business and starting out. It’s very hard to do that because there’s some of these projects like black thoughts. We didn’t have the money or the budget, but I think it was on us to make sure that we conveyed that to the crew members like hey, this is this is what this weird animal is and this is what you’re signing up for. And God help me please like that. Don’t let this come across is like one of those crazy phone calls was like what’s the pay experience and pizzas like

49:46

be that guy. When you try to communicate in a way to where people know like, hey, the this is certainly not going to be the norm for experiences working with with Dwayne Logan

50:00

Well, and I think, you know, cuz I’ll jump on the bandwagon with you of providing value to the crew and making sure that, you know, we’re never trying to nickel and dime anybody. It’s not about that. But, you know, I do think there’s, there’s passion projects that, you know, do they take a little money to make happen? Sure, but is the bigger objective to be beyond just this is your day job, you know, this is your day rate, this is you know, so I think there’s, there’s always the opportunity for people to have that chance to buy into a project and say, I’m willing to do this for next to nothing, I’m willing to, you know, kind of provide the sweat equity, to see the same get done. And that’s a choice that any crew member can make, you know, from the top down. But then there’s your, of course, your your day job, there’s your, we’re going out to shoot this for a client, and

50:51

to your point, this was my rate, then it came down here, then it came down here, and that becomes the norm. And I think, you know, I’ll go on the record saying that it gets very difficult to perform your duties when you constantly get pushed down on rate, and whether that’s the whole production, or whether that’s, you’ve got to have another crew member, and you don’t have the budget for so you got to just ask one person to drop, they’re like, no matter what part of the puzzle it is, that becomes very difficult to do more than once more than twice, you know, I think everybody’s willing to give a little bit. But you’re asking me to give a little bit every single time you’re devaluing, you’re showing that I’m not worth what I bring to the table. And, you know, I remember shoot specifically when I was a production manager way back in the day that we had to move about six cars to get this sunset shot, because these cars were in the background. And I mean, we couldn’t get a move fast enough before the light was going to go away. And so we had some pa is trying to move them and they weren’t moving fast enough. And you know, I’m taking off running down this hill, grabbing keys on the way and just start moving these cars because we got to go.

52:01

And when you’re asking somebody to cut their rate from this to this, you’re asking for me to not care enough for me to not give that effort, you know what I mean? So

52:13

it takes a special person to give that effort time and time again, and everybody else is gonna just quit, they’re gonna say, I’m not gonna do this shoot for that amount. And so there’s there’s my rant for it, but I’m certainly right there with you that, you know, is it all about money? No. But is it all about value? Yes. Like, don’t devalue me enough times.

52:34

I love that so much and unsexual real part of his business as a whole, I’ve never met a person that’s gonna work hard and give you 110% when they feel like they have no value, you ideally want for crew members to be there, because they have a reason to be there, I want to be here, I want to run down that hill with those keys to help get the shot. And, and to me, I just, I’m so passionate about that. And I feel like as an ad, I’ve tried really, really hard to make that the reputation that hey, like if I if I see Dwayne’s name on a call sheet, and then this guy’s going to bat for me one way or another, that I’m in good company, and this is going to be a crew oriented, shooting that together, we’re all going to be able to come and knock this thing out. And the very fascinating side of that is sometimes you you become such an advocate that especially as an ad, you start to hear all sorts of things that just

53:30

a way we’re running out of, we’re running out of Gatorade over is like that is so not a big responsibility. But you could come to me with whatever whatever is on your heart at the moment. Or god help is doing we’ve got to push these cards through through this gravel. It’s like I wish I could change the shape of the earth that we have trucks on but is as it is, but then I love that that’s where it is, you know that the crew members, they all feel like, hey, if I’m in it, Dwayne’s in it with me, I just love that example you gave the bike, I’ll go get those keys.

54:07

And that’s doing that’s doing good business does that’s doing the kind of business that I want to be a part of, and I want people to be excited when they see the phone ring, and then it’s got anything to do with my name on it.

54:20

And it’s really hard to

54:24

to work backwards from having the opposite of that reputation is I mean, it’s possible. But man Good luck. You know, once you were known for that person that’s going to beat the Korean to the ground that’s going to take more than you give. And, you know, just as well as their names that that go along with that that are synonymous with that.

54:47

And I don’t I don’t ever want it to be the thing or it’s like all you’re about to pull a logon it’s like

54:55

it’s true. Well and my mentality is I’m never gonna ask anything anybody to do anything that

55:00

I’m not willing to do myself, you know, I think, is there a time and place for me to do those things versus the person we’ve hired on the shoot to do those things? Yeah, of course. Because, you know, at some point, I can’t be the one carrying all the sandbags because there’s other things that have to be done that only I know how to do. And it’s no disrespect to the person who has to carry sandbags. But that’s, that’s your job. That’s what you got to do. But I’m willing to do it with you. If it boils down to it, you know, and I think having that mentality really, regardless of the business you’re in, regardless of where you’re at in life, but you know, it’s it’s really that mindset of running as fast as you can look to your right and left who’s running with you, those are the people we want on the team, those are the people we want to try and keep up with. Because we know that they’re running hard, they’re not just freeloading, they’re not just feeling like they got to the top now they can coast.

55:49

And it’s so good, when you’re just saying that it made me think about something else, like that I’m really happy for was the experience of having worked in, in each department before becoming an ad. And then before becoming a director into the eye, you seen 1001 times, you know, some crazy person with a bullhorn jumps out on set, and it’s like, I need this and I need it. Now it’s like, but

56:14

if you know what you’re asking for, you know, it’s not coming anytime soon, because it’s gonna take them some time to do that. And it’s so grateful for the opportunity to learn and give when

56:26

someone’s having a fit. And they’re saying I need our department to, it seems so trivial, I just need them to put together that little shelf. And get that in here. Because we didn’t like this when we want to swap it out. And our department says, okay, it’s in a box, and you say you didn’t want it, but now you want to, we’re going to tell her to turn around and bring it back, we’re going to build it. You know, like having been there, you’re tinkering with those goofy little hex wrenches, and it’s like, they’re gonna go as fast as they can, is gonna be a second. And or, you know, like when they say, Hey, we just need I love the word just and I get thrown around, and it’s just a shiny board, we just need a shiny board over there, just get a shiny board over there. And you know, that thing weights and you know, what it feels like when it’s on your shoulder, you know, when that combo Stan is connected to it, what it’s like to care that thing, and then you look at the grass that that guy is going to track to really get it down to that it’s like, knowing and understanding what will the crew members are actually feeling and having some experience in those departments. And I mean, you can never know it all. But at least having enough to empathize with each of those departments i think is what what should be mandatory for any leader of any company have know what you’re asking for. And then when you ask for it a your appreciation for for when you get it is going to be so much more

57:46

the be like the the ability to have informed conversations and, and better expectations, when you’re asking for things, and just get all get ironed out so much better. And it really just shouldn’t be this mandatory thing for any leader, to have to have some level of understanding of who he’s eating and what he’s asking them to do.

58:06

I love it. And to I think the fact that you’re never too old to learn something new to jump in on something that you haven’t experienced, you know, if if you were able to get to a certain part in your company, or on film set, or whatever it is, and you didn’t ever have to have the experience, putting a shelf together or, you know, carrying a shiny board up a hill and through a creek and, you know, all the things that go along with that

58:31

doesn’t mean you can still do it and figure it out and understand it. And once you know now, you know when you ask somebody else for it, okay, I’ll be patient, I’ll give them a second to actually do it. You know, if you’re an accounting, you’ve made your way up into management, but never had to put a spreadsheet together well, maybe put a spreadsheet together. So when you ask that junior level accountant to give you these reports, you know what they’re asking for.

58:55

I love that so much might be a leader that listens, and be a leader that that is that people feel confident communicating to. Because if you’re this big, intimidating, fire breathing dragon, it’s like give me the spreadsheet, then you know, they’re not going to really give you the reality of what it takes the you know, the the intimidation factor is there and now the conversation can’t be had and, and there’s so much to be said about

59:21

being able to gain that experience through conversation with the people that you lead. I see so many correlations to coaching boils down to trust. I mean, ultimately, if you just earn the trust, and that’s the key word is earned the trust of the people that are working for you, then it shouldn’t be an issue, you know, then it shouldn’t be a matter of being manipulated or not knowing how to do something and worrying if you’re overpaying for it. Just be a human interacting with other humans create trust, and it’s all gonna work out. I want to jump into this real quick when we talk about how we got somewhere how we get to a place in life.

1:00:01

Most people now there are exceptions to the rule, but most people don’t get there just through their own determination and grit. That’s always a key element but 90% of the time there’s somebody else that they looked up to that they could lean on and and I refer to those people in our lives as Titans right? So who are some of the Titans in your life that kind of gave you that inspiration gave you those those moments of, I either want to be like that, or they helped guide me to this place. You have anybody like that in your life? Man, so many I love how you how you worry about that as well, because there’s

1:00:41

that I refer to it as this bootstraps. connotation, or the bootstraps idea that’s like a human just pull themselves up by the bootstraps. And then you know, hard work pays off. And you’ll get out there and get is that ended. There. I love Dr. King said, it’s, it’s cruel to tell a man to pull himself up by his boots when he doesn’t have any.

1:01:02

And there are some people that don’t, and really do just need someone to believe in them. And to see that they are willing to do the work, but they just need some assistance. I firmly believe that that really is how it all works, that at the end of the day, it takes a community one way or another. And there’s someone that that got a pause what they’re doing, and look outside of their bubble and see someone else and say, Hey, I’m going to get involved in that. Even if sometimes it’s for

1:01:33

less than pious reasons, but there’s there’s just this handshake that happens from human to human that really gets to go on. And I’ve had so many wonderful people like that in my life. The the first one that comes to mind is

1:01:49

the wonderful teacher, Mr. Meltzer, in high school that pushed me into gymnastics. And I think there’s so much of my life that I’ve been positively impacted by becoming a coach. And it was just one of the best things that ever happened to me, I went on and was given the opportunity to lead the P unit of gymnastics first full credit. And that introduced me to the men’s gymnastics team. Coach who then pulled me in and had me teach summer camps with him that introduced me to john and Judy Redmond, who are the next Titans that I think of in my life. They were

1:02:30

private owners of a USA Gymnastics club in in town, and they heard about me and said, Hey, we’re going to you’re, you’re coming along, whether you like it or not, we’re going to make a decent coach out of St. JOHN and Judy Redmond for certain, the more and more I think about it, and teachers and educators have had have been on both ends of the spectrum for me, they’ve been Titans for me, and they’ve created some of the most memorable paintings for me. And they’ve been on both ends of that.

1:03:00

And the ones that have made the positive impact, and I cannot stress enough, like the I just I hope that every teacher on the planet understands the potential that they have to change a life for the better for the worse. And for the ones that change mine for the better. I’m so grateful. God, I’m so grateful for the teacher that looked at some poetry that I wrote and said, this is really good. And when I brushed it off to notice that, listen, there’s something here you can write.

1:03:33

In here, I am now writing films. And I think about one of the pieces of feedback that I just received from the thumb festival is they go down this critique list and they say old cinematography,

1:03:48

zero to 10. Like, where do we put it in writing? Zero to 10? Where do we put it? And over and over and over again, the numbers for the writing were 10 910. And I was like, Oh, my God, it’s so incredibly humbling to see that. And I think back to the teacher that told me that that there was something there and man, just on that alone, I think about the more I think of it, the more Titans that pop up, and the more and the more you just want to be able to, as they say, give people their their flowers when they can still smell that makes me want to just kind of run outside and find them all and kiss him and hug him and say thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Oh, love it. Well,

1:04:31

I think you’re exactly right. I think sometimes teachers themselves forget but I think a lot of people just forget the the impact, both positive and negative that teachers can have on our lives. And the reality is, we’re all teachers at times, you know, I think there’s formal paid teachers in certain environments, but like we’ve been talking about on film sets in different types of workplace environments.

1:04:57

Somebody’s always watching somebody is always there needing

1:05:00

encouragement, leadership, teaching. And we’ve got the impact or the opportunity to create the impact on that person very much the same way that a teacher does or a coach does with a young person in school. So that’s really cool that you’ve had those people. I want to move into a few quick questions. These are always kind of fun just rattling off the first thing that comes to mind.

1:05:24

Well, let’s start with your best or latest book that you’ve read.

1:05:28

Man, the, my favorite book, and probably the last one that I finished from ese was Jesus and the disinherited by Howard Thurman. And it’s he was the, the writer and speaker that inspired Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. and just that that nugget alone made me really fascinated, interesting case, what is this guy? What does he have to say that would inspire sexual tremendous world leader, and it is me it is a it is a hammer of a book to walk to the heart ages, it leaves you It leaves an indelible mark that you’ll never get rid of.

1:06:06

of cool, what what’s a daily routine that you have to do? I feel like if the day goes by, and I’ve not created something, it’s going to be it’s going to be a tough day, there’s a, there’s a part of me that that feels a very, very necessary need to say I’ve made something they can, it can be the smallest thing, but it got to bring something out of an idea into reality. And if that’s

1:06:35

all around our house, there are different art forms that I love their paintings that use different mediums that I’ve created. There’s photography, sitting at a music studio as we speak, and the ability to sketch and to draw or to write, but it’s if if the day goes by and I’ve not created, it’s it’s not a great day.

1:06:59

I feel you on that. What’s the best piece of advice you’ve ever been given or that you’ve ever given or received? Whoa, man, there’s so much there. It’s it’s one that’s almost contradictory to my beliefs. But it’s, it’s, it’s been so helpful.

1:07:18

And I believe it’s Maya Angelou that said, is if someone shows you who they are, believe them.

1:07:26

And it’s contradictory in a way, because I’m very much a believer that people can change.

1:07:32

But understanding that for the most part, humanity is yet we’re very stubborn creatures. And

1:07:43

we certainly don’t make adjustments easily. And usually it takes tremendous pain or some sort of life altering

1:07:52

encounter to change it. So

1:07:56

I spent a lot of time in my being very naive, very trusting very

1:08:03

think the best of people first and find out the rest later. And I still am in many ways, but

1:08:10

I love that quote, because there’s so much truth in it that if they show you who they are, believe them for the better for the worst. It’s true. All right, if you could write a book, what would the title be? Or if you had a billboard out on the highway, what would your message be? Add a billboard is another quote that comes to mind.

1:08:32

And it says that people catch an opinion as one catches measles, which is by contagion.

1:08:38

And to be mindful of, of that, in in our efforts to

1:08:47

try to carve out what’s true and what’s not.

1:08:51

And reminding us that the

1:08:55

all of the things that that we think we know, to question them and to really do the hard work of getting to the bottom of what it is that we believe in why we believe it.

1:09:06

And to never stop that self examination of how we came to some of the conclusions that we’ve come to.

1:09:13

And that would probably be the Billboard and just a nice reminder there that just so we know that we stay aware that

1:09:23

people catch an opinion usually based on the environment around

1:09:29

a lot. So true.

1:09:32

I like this or what’s the best thing you’ve bought in the last year for $100 or less.

1:09:38

Oh man, I’m such a sneaker junkie like the first thing that popped in my head is just shoe shoe shoes. I bought a really great pair of shoes where I got a score and they weren’t that expensive. They were probably underneath 100 those are not great investments.

1:09:56

Easily The first thing that just jumped into my head is just this crazy.

1:10:00

sneaker collection I’ve got him from Chicago it’s in the bloodstream

1:10:05

love it favorite artist or type of music I am

1:10:09

I am a sucker for a female voice in acapella I just did is I will scour the internet to find some lovely soul that is ditch the piano and all of the instrumentation and is just a let allowing the the instrument that is the human voice out there for people to hear.

1:10:36

And then I think I’m also

1:10:39

a huge fan of

1:10:42

drum lines I just got into something so, so cool about hearing like a really really great drum line. And as a as a dancer, my wife’s a dancer.

1:10:54

Anything that gets a gets the thing joints move in. I’m a big fan of that as well. Yeah, we have very frequent dance parties in the house with a girl and

1:11:04

then it’s dance is such a huge part of our lives so we can dance to it. We’re probably going to be a fair

1:11:12

Alright, favorite food? Where are you going to eat? What are you cooking at home tonight? And it’s spicy. All of that. So we grew up with a stepfather that was from Nigeria and

1:11:26

I have no idea how much we like spicy before that but that’s certainly accelerated and then the Nashville and the whole hot chicken trainees the tap and here I am a part of the reason why those businesses are doing very very well. I take my money take all of my money a bit. He put our chicken on a bun put it on a stick put it just give it to me Give me a more chicken since I haven’t had any all week. Now that we we’ve brought it up. I think that’s probably where I’m at.

1:12:01

Last time I was in town, I noticed the new Hattie B’s downtown and fifth and Broadway. So it’s everywhere down there. But I love it. Well, Dwayne, where can people check out more about you the work you’re putting out? short film. I’ve got the website for all of my directorial stuff. That’s Dwayne Logan, calm. Thank goodness, I was able to get that address. It’s weird. It’s a weird new world like thinking about business, I had no idea that there are people that make money by just buying IP addresses, then you got to fight them for it and pay them for it. Maybe that’s something I should to look more into. But Dwayne hogan.com that’s the very general broad, sweeping one. And then for the short film, there’s black thoughts film calm. And there’s a very talented musician that was a part of the roots that goes by the name of black thought, which I did not realize it’s like we’re sharing some some internet space with it. And so if you don’t put film on the end of that, you just probably end up somewhere listening to his music. So black box film calm. Hello, doing man, I really appreciate you taking the time. It’s been a fantastic conversation. I think there’s a lot more we could cover we can talk about probably go a lot deeper on some of these topics and subjects but we’ll definitely save that for maybe a cup of coffee at Fido. Next time. I’m in town. And but man, I love what you’re doing Keep it up. You’re you’re making a dent in the the positive changes of the world. So certainly appreciate all those efforts. And thanks for being on the podcast. Man. Thank you so much, Brad. You’ll be looking forward to find it.

1:13:46

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